Apologies I typed too fast and hence the incomplete title. I was wondering if "Killing" on video games will led to the same bad karma as in killing a person real life? Even though how "innocence" the virtual killing is?
Originally posted by *=Optimus=*:Apologies I typed too fast and hence the incomplete title. I was wondering if "Killing" on video games will led to the same bad karma as in killing a person real life? Even though how "innocence" the virtual killing is?
I don't think so, but it is nevertheless still planting a negative unwholesome seed in your 8th consciousness that will sprout and turn into something bad in the future.
That is, if the seed meets conditions (like a bad environment encourage violent tendencies deeply rooted in the mind, etc).
I personally like to play some FPS games though not too into gaming these days :P
Thanks bro for helping me with the title. All right I did a search just now and I came upon this interesting video by 净空法师. He strongly disapproved violent video games and suggested that video game players/makers suffer a karma "worse than the slaughterhouse butcher" Any thoughts on this? Btw I also noted out of 344 viewers, 268 didn't like his statment lmao.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYi7MseHzos&feature=related
Originally posted by *=Optimus=*:Thanks bro for helping me with the title. All right I did a search just now and I came upon this interesting video by 净空法师. He strongly disapproved violent video games and suggested that video game players/makers suffer a karma "worse than the slaughterhouse butcher" Any thoughts on this? Btw I also noted out of 344 viewers, 268 didn't like his statment lmao.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYi7MseHzos&feature=related
He's only refering to the makers, not the game players (or at least I don't think he said that video game players are going to hell).
I don't exactly agree that playing a video game is anything near killing a real person.
However I would also like to give him benefit of doubt on his comments on video game makers, because what he said has some scriptural basis. (Master Chin Kung is a famous sutra explainer and commentator and must be very familiar with them, so I believe his comments usually have some direct or indirect scriptural backing or source and aren't just made up by himself)
For example, the Buddha actually said that actors that incite people's passions (the three poisons of Greed, Hatred, Ignorance) are destined for rebirth in hell, so by this logic I believe this equally applies to video game makers:
(oh btw before I quote the sutta just wanna add 2 points: Buddha is refering to actors here, not audiences, and also when I play video games I just play mindlessly and emotionlessly without hatred or anger as I understand them to be totally illusory and virtual and so I don't think I'm at fault of being 'inspired passions', in the same way that when I watch a movie I don't hate the actor for acting as a bad guy because he's just an actor, therefore I personally think my playing games is quite blameless even though I can't say this is the case for others)
SN 42.2
PTS: S iv 306
CDB ii 1333
Talaputa Sutta: To Talaputa the Actor
translated from the Pali by
Thanissaro Bhikkhu
© 1998–2010
On one occasion the Blessed One was staying near Rajagaha in the Bamboo Grove, the Squirrel's Sanctuary.
Then Talaputa, the head of an acting troupe, went to the Blessed One and, on arrival, having bowed down to him, sat to one side. As he was sitting there he said to the Blessed One: "Lord, I have heard that it has been passed down by the ancient teaching lineage of actors that 'When an actor on the stage, in the midst of a festival, makes people laugh & gives them delight with his imitation of reality, then with the breakup of the body, after death, he is reborn in the company of the laughing devas.' What does the Blessed One have to say about that?"
"Enough, headman, put that aside. Don't ask me that."
A second time... A third time Talaputa, the head of an acting troupe, said: "Lord, I have heard that it has been passed down by the ancient teaching lineage of actors that 'When an actor on the stage, in the midst of a festival, makes people laugh & gives them delight with his imitation of reality, then with the breakup of the body, after death, he is reborn in the company of the laughing devas.' What does the Blessed One have to say about that?"
"Apparently, headman, I haven't been able to get past you by saying, 'Enough, headman, put that aside. Don't ask me that.' So I will simply answer you. Any beings who are not devoid of passion to begin with, who are bound by the bond of passion, focus with even more passion on things inspiring passion presented by an actor on stage in the midst of a festival. Any beings who are not devoid of aversion to begin with, who are bound by the bond of aversion, focus with even more aversion on things inspiring aversion presented by an actor on stage in the midst of a festival. Any beings who are not devoid of delusion to begin with, who are bound by the bond of delusion, focus with even more delusion on things inspiring delusion presented by an actor on stage in the midst of a festival. Thus the actor — himself intoxicated & heedless, having made others intoxicated & heedless — with the breakup of the body, after death, is reborn in what is called the hell of laughter. But if he holds such a view as this: 'When an actor on the stage, in the midst of a festival, makes people laugh & gives them delight with his imitation of reality, then with the breakup of the body, after death, he is reborn in the company of the laughing devas,' that is his wrong view. Now, there are two destinations for a person with wrong view, I tell you: either hell or the animal womb."
When this was said, Talaputa, the head of an acting troupe, sobbed & burst into tears. [The Blessed One said:] "That is what I couldn't get past you by saying, 'Enough, headman, put that aside. Don't ask me that.'"
"I'm not crying, lord, because of what the Blessed One said to me, but simply because I have been deceived, cheated, & fooled for a long time by that ancient teaching lineage of actors who said: 'When an actor on the stage, in the midst of a festival, makes people laugh & gives them delight with his imitation of reality, then with the breakup of the body, after death, he is reborn in the company of the laughing devas.'
"Magnificent, lord! Magnificent! Just as if he were to place upright what was overturned, to reveal what was hidden, to show the way to one who was lost, or to carry a lamp into the dark so that those with eyes could see forms, in the same way has the Blessed One — through many lines of reasoning — made the Dhamma clear. I go to the Blessed One for refuge, to the Dhamma, and to the Community of monks. May the Blessed One remember me as a lay follower who has gone to him for refuge, from this day forward, for life."
Originally posted by *=Optimus=*:Apologies I typed too fast and hence the incomplete title. I was wondering if "Killing" on video games will led to the same bad karma as in killing a person real life? Even though how "innocence" the virtual killing is?
Karma is very subtle. Most people when i see them play video games are very engrossed and caught up in the game. When they kill, there is a certain aggression, and when the enemy gets killed, they rejoice. There is alot of mental upheaval. No doubt this is one of the attractions of video game... but i think it will create karma most definitely.
The four factors of karma /actions include:
1. Basis (ie, object you do the negative act on)
2. Intention (or motivation)
3. Action
4. Completion of the act
If the four factors are present, then the karma is complete. In the case of video games, the four factors are present. But the karma is not strong because the basis, which is a non-existent enemy in the video game being killed, is weak. So although karma is created, but basis being weak, therefore karma is not strong. However, if one repeatedly does it, we can imagine that you are building up strong karma.
Even if one wishes to say that the basis is not a factor because it is just a game, but the other three factors still exist, so it makes it an incomplete karma but still karma is created.
One of my relatives (young kid) played video games until he developed a quite aggressive personality. I think it is not a joking matter.
You can read more about the workings of karma here...
Personally, those people who work in mass media (including video games, i guess) should be very careful for what kind of effect they have on others. It is a responsibility. And i always think that whatever they do multiplies many times, good acts are manifold, so are negative acts. I used to have pasttime of writing novels before learning Buddhism, but after i thought about this aspect of karma, i am quite careful about what i choose to do.
Originally posted by wisdomeye:
Karma is very subtle. Most people when i see them play video games are very engrossed and caught up in the game. When they kill, there is a certain aggression, and when the enemy gets killed, they rejoice. There is alot of mental upheaval. No doubt this is one of the attractions of video game... but i think it will create karma most definitely.The four factors of karma include:
1. Basis (ie, object you do the negative act on)
2. Intention (or motivation)
3. Action
4. Completion of the act
If the four factors are present, then the karma is complete. In the case of video games, the four factors are present. But the karma is not strong because the basis, which is a non-existent enemy in the video game is being killed. So although karma is created, but basis being weak, therefore karma is not strong. However, if one repeatedly does it, we can imagine that you are building up strong karma.
One of my relatives (young kid) played video games until he developed a quite aggressive personality. I think it is not a joking matter.
You can read more about the workings of karma here...
Personally, those people who work in mass media (including video games, i guess) should be very careful for what kind of effect they have on others. It is a responsibility. And i always think that whatever they do multiplies many times, good acts are manifold, so are negative acts. I used to have pasttime of writing novels before learning Buddhism, but after i thought about this aspect of karma, i am quite careful about what i choose to do.
Even my church pastor tell us not to play violent game. It will affect subsconcious mind. Esp realistic 3 D violent games.
Pornographic game is bad too. I have relatives who played pornographic games until the mind very perverted. Everytime yellow jokes.
Looking at sexy pictures for a long time also bad for subsconcious. My pastor asked the male teenager to cut down on maxim FHM all those.
ever heard, tearing a peice of paper with aggression also got karma. so it's good to be Mindful.
《地è—�ç»�》说: å�—阎浮æ��众生(æ£æŒ‡æˆ‘们所居ä½�的世界),起心动念,æ— ä¸�是罪,æ— ä¸�是业。
At that time Ksitigarbha Mahasattva said to the Buddha, "World Honored One, I see that every single movement or stirring of thought on the part of beings of Jambudvipa is an offense, is a karma. ---- Ksitigarbha Sutra Chapter 7
--------
At that time, the Bodhisattva-Mahasattva Ksitigarbha addressed the Buddha, saying, "O World Honored One, I see that the sentient beings in Jambudvipa are doing nothing but committing karma when a thought arises or when an idea is generated. --- Ksitigarbha Sutra Chapter 7
/\
Thanks everyone for sharing. I have another question for you brothers; can a person doing self-harm knowingly (either physically or mentally) creates bad karma for him too?
Originally posted by *=Optimus=*:Thanks everyone for sharing. I have another question for you brothers; can a person doing self-harm knowingly (either physically or mentally) creates bad karma for him too?
Definitely. Btw those who commit suicide will fall into the lower realms... one must prevent any friends or relatives from having the foolish thought that suicide ends their problems. Best to educate them on the existence of six realms.
Hi Optimus
When a person do self inflict harm on one body, most probably he has caught up in his murky state of karma . Based on Tien Tai teaching on 10 states of existence, pyschological speaking that person is experiencing the state of Hell, where he experience pain and anger. He will need to reconcile what is within his heart. He need to confront the inner struggle to let go of the attachment so that healing can take place.
Nichiren wrote, "Life is the most precious of all treasures. Even one extra day of life is worth more than ten million ryo of gold." (ON PROLONGING ONE’S LIFE SPAN)
To a dying person, every minute counts and he pray that he could live on.
To a brokenhearted person every minute is a drag, he pray that his life will come to an end.
To an enlightened being, he will let go of the attachment, accepts its effect, move on and live the life to the fullest for the benefit of himself and others!
Gassho
Namu Myoho Renge Kyo
�無妙法蓮�經
Originally posted by An Eternal Now:Definitely. Btw those who commit suicide will fall into the lower realms... one must prevent any friends or relatives from having the foolish thought that suicide ends their problems. Best to educate them on the existence of six realms.
If the relative or friends have sucidal thoughts, one should recommend them for counsuelling and if they show signs of depression refer them to a psychiatrist.
Sucidal thoughts are symptoms of many mental illnesses esp depression.
Originally posted by -StarDust-:
If the relative or friends have sucidal thoughts, one should recommend them for counsuelling and if they show signs of depression refer them to a psychiatrist.Sucidal thoughts are symptoms of many mental illnesses esp depression.
Originally posted by An Eternal Now:
Good idea also.
Thanks for ur compliment.
Originally posted by *=Optimus=*:Thanks everyone for sharing. I have another question for you brothers; can a person doing self-harm knowingly (either physically or mentally) creates bad karma for him too?
maybe you got to provide more specific details...
�無妙法蓮�經 explain this phrase?
Sokka Gakai like to chant this too?
Namu Myoho Renge Kyo
My sokka gakkai frenz alway chant this phrase one leh.
Namu Myoho Renge Kyo
But I never ask my frenz wad it means.
My sokka frenz like quite obsessed with lotus sutra.
Originally posted by reborn76:Hi Optimus
When a person do self inflict harm on one body, most probably he has caught up in his murky state of karma . Based on Tien Tai teaching on 10 states of existence, pyschological speaking that person is experiencing the state of Hell, where he experience pain and anger. He will need to reconcile what is within his heart. He need to confront the inner struggle to let go of the attachment so that healing can take place.
Nichiren wrote, "Life is the most precious of all treasures. Even one extra day of life is worth more than ten million ryo of gold." (ON PROLONGING ONE’S LIFE SPAN)
To a dying person, every minute counts and he pray that he could live on.
To a brokenhearted person every minute is a drag, he pray that his life will come to an end.
To an enlightened being, he will let go of the attachment, accepts its effect, move on and live the life to the fullest for the benefit of himself and others!
Gassho
Namu Myoho Renge Kyo
�無妙法蓮�經
Thank you so much for your explanation. Thanks An eternal now too for your reply. But does knowingly and refuse to give up attachment and choosing to suffer as a consequence by itself brings bad karma..as in creating bad karma within the state of bad karma.
Btw there's a youtube video circulating by someone who rejects the notation of karma and he spoke about it. In some sense his explanation sounds reasonable...just for sharing
Originally posted by -StarDust-:�無妙法蓮�經 explain this phrase?
Sokka Gakai like to chant this too?
Namu Myoho Renge Kyo
Originally posted by *=Optimus=*:Thank you so much for your explanation. Thanks An eternal now too for your reply. But does knowingly and refuse to give up attachment and choosing to suffer as a consequence by itself brings bad karma..as in creating bad karma within the state of bad karma.
Originally posted by An Eternal Now:
Yes. Take refuge in Lotus Sutra. Not only Soka Gakkai, but more mainstream Nichiren schools like Nichiren Shu practices this.
How come they like to chant that phrase?
Namu Myoho Renge Kyo �無妙法蓮�經
Sokka gakia only chant/recite lotus sutra?
Originally posted by *=Optimus=*:Btw there's a youtube video circulating by someone who rejects the notation of karma and he spoke about it. In some sense his explanation sounds reasonable...just for sharing
Is gokka gakai buddhism too?