Sunshine Empire
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Originally posted by Charm_83:
hi,
i had to say that i am a "customer" of SE first. My upline has offer me 2 options
1) to change over to Emmax
2) to ask for a refund frm the coy. But he remind me that SE is a private entity meaning that they gt limited captial of 2 million nia.. Haiz so it mean my refund might not be even successful
To choose option 1 mean i need to go down to TPY and sign a form and present a photostat of my IC which i feel very unsafe cos the Coy is now based in HK and i was told that it is not even a concrete coy but some flooding coy that operate via the Net.
If you are in my shoes, what will you all do??
They will ask you to sign a document to resign from SE and tell you that EMmax will do its best to START paying you back after 6 months. It may be in installment for the next 2-3 years.
DONT ever resign from SE. ASK and PRESS for refund. Resigning from SE will be giving up ALL THE RIGHTS for your money in SE. DONT BE WORRIED about paid up capital, its not an issue here at all. Tell SE, you will go to CAD and CASE if you CANT get the refund. DONT be soft, its YOUR money.
If anything happen to EMmax, you can either fly to hong kong later to sue the company or you kissed your money good bye forever. AND you CANT go to Singapore police or any legal organisation here for help.
GO to CAD and give them a record of everything. In the event that SE closed down, you will be regarded as a victim and not a 'accomplice'.
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Thank for all the response.. I seriously dun wish to "transfer" my account to Em max cos i do also understand that by doing so i am legally losing my right that i might have in SG...
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Why is SE closing down?
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alamak~!!!!!!
This discussion still going damn strong manz.....for many many years...haha
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Hi Accurate Fraud, Yes, agree. MLM allow the unprivilege to attain success BUT Sunshine empire was NEVER an MLM. If you are/once was a lawyer, u should know where to check that better. You sure we need more of James Phang around? James Phang make his mark through pyramid scheme which has always been illegal in the eyes of the law. He has NEVER been in a MLM company. This is factual. EVERY company he set up subsequently since year 1999 are all disguised MLM companies with pyramid scheme intentions using the binary system. SO.. in saying that we need more Phangs around, are you advocating success achievements via illegal means is the way to go in Singapore? Your arguement on Singapore economy being a pyramid structure bla bla is comparing orange to pork.. the illegal pyramid system is when transfer of wealth/cash has no goods/services provided in it, meaning its pure money gaming. which legitimate company in Singapore has that? 95% of the people who benefited from Sunshine empire and all those companies that Phang sets up make it rich because they joined the company EARLY. Those that comes in 12 months later ALL make losses. Those that make it are at the GREAT expense of others. Now using the brains of a RI/RJC boy - what is the profile of this group of people that will join the company? Do they even deserve to make it rich knowing that its at the expense of others? Would you call this a legitimate form of business/investment plan that can help the poor and gap up the income bridge of Singaporeans? All these are FACTUAL. Everyone here can give you a proof on this. Every company has failed projects - but they DO NOT have FANTASY ONES that dont exist but widely publicised in the first place. This again is FACTUAL. Many company got investigated and still in business. ALL James Phang's set up attracts the CAD. And all change name/objectives after investigations. This again is also FACTUAL. Singapore government investigate SE. Malaysian police raided, suspended and investigating SE for money laundering. Indonesian police investigated and put SE on the black listed of companies in the country. Taiwan and Malaysia officials deny any projects that Phang said SE is involved in the respective country... so...... my dear lawyer, in your area of study, tell me.. where did all these accusation, suspicions derive itself from? Sorry but i really doubt you were a lawyer. Your patterns of tots are too frail to be one. I am a private equity manager for an offshore bank. I deal with lawyers all the time in my area of work. Unlike you stating unfactual opinions or views of Phang and asking us to appreciate him, i am here to give you FACTS on why we shouldnt. And yes, its personal cos your statements on Phang are as irresponsible as the companies he set up. Its glad to know that you are living in a foreign land, we have enough of gullible people in Singapore already.
Wow. Is it no longer possible to have a debate in Singapore? Are people not allowed to have different opinions? I suppose the state suppression of the media has resulted in Singaporeans being unable to handle dissenting views. If you have an opinion or if you disagree with mine, argue your point using fact and logic, instead of resorting to personal attacks.
Firstly, let me say a few things. I have not done extensive research on Sunshine Empire and I have no idea as to the details that you guys are discussing. I am simply making very general statements, based on my overall opinion of MLM and a cursory knowledge of what I know about James Phang and Sunshine. I have no knowledge of Phang's previous companies.First of all, I think we are making some very serious allegations here.
1) Some of you have alleged that Sunshine Empire is not even an MLM at all, but rather, a ponzi scheme. The basis of MLM is that products must be sold to the end-users. A ponzi scheme is a scheme where people earn commissions from recruiting others into the scheme, with totally no product being sold.
2) I understand that Sunshine is offering an investment plan, offering distributors the chance to invest in certain real estate projects in Malaysia. This is its product, MLM is merely the method of marketing the product.
3) Some of you have alleged that the construction and real estate project were deliberately conjured up by Phang as a means of duping investors into purchasing the plans. The allegation here is that Phang's projects are total fabrication and he did not have, nor will he ever have, the intention of actually completing the construction of the projects. This is a very serious allegation, and so far, there has been no evidence offered by any of the posters on this forum to support this allegation. All we are relying on so far is hearsay and rumours, based on individuals' perceptions of Phang's personality. Can we really rely on this to conclude that all of Phang's proposed property developments are utter fabrications? How then would one explain the detailed floor plans that Phang has provided? How are we to explain the photos of Phang and his colleagues at the construction sites, laying the foundations for the projects?
4) Some have mentioned that "ALL" of Phang's previous business ventures have been blacklisted by the CAD and/or shut down by the relevant authorities in various countries. Again, no sources were provided to support this. However, I only have one question to ask regarding this point. Why is Phang still a free man? Why has no dirt stuck to him, and why has he never been sent to prison? Surely, if he is a repeat offender, and one who has claimed thousands of victims across various jurisdictions, at least one criminal charge should have stuck to him by now?
5) Just because a company is under investigation does not mean they are guilty of any wrong doing. If they have indeed engaged in any wrong doing, then a prosecution must be brought, and a conviction must be secured. Or have we never heard of the maxim "innocent until proven guilty"?
I admit that I have little knowledge of Phang's personal history. However, I am basing my opinions on two things - One, the testimonies of two acquaintances whom I have personally met, and who have confirmed to me that they have made substantial profits as a result of their participation as distributors of Sunshine Empire. Two, the posts on this forum and the evidence cited to support the various arguments that have been offered.
I am merely offering the "other side of the coin", not supporting James Phang. I do not know the man, and cannot vouch for his character personally. However, I am very surprised that the mere mention of his name has managed to elicit such visceral and emotive reactions in people who similarly do not know him. Perhaps you have allowed yourselves to be worked up by sensational news reports and/or scandalous rumours spread by Phang's opponents. If they have failed in MLM, perhaps they themselves have to shoulder some responsibility, instead of simply blaming it all on the company. It is simply the easy way out to blame one's environment, just as a failed stock trader would blame the volatile market conditions, or a failed property investor would criticise the unpredictability of the real estate market. The fact remains that in any sort of business, there is an element of risk, and an element of reward.
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Wah, it has been some time sinced I've logged on,
Nth can be said till results by CAD is out,
Anyway Emmax doing so well now.
cheers
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huh?
Mr JP denied the existence of Emmax so publicly
You bluffing who?
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Originally posted by Accurate Fraud:
Wow. Is it no longer possible to have a debate in Singapore? Are people not allowed to have different opinions? I suppose the state suppression of the media has resulted in Singaporeans being unable to handle dissenting views. If you have an opinion or if you disagree with mine, argue your point using fact and logic, instead of resorting to personal attacks.
Firstly, let me say a few things. I have not done extensive research on Sunshine Empire and I have no idea as to the details that you guys are discussing. I am simply making very general statements, based on my overall opinion of MLM and a cursory knowledge of what I know about James Phang and Sunshine. I have no knowledge of Phang's previous companies.First of all, I think we are making some very serious allegations here.
1) Some of you have alleged that Sunshine Empire is not even an MLM at all, but rather, a ponzi scheme. The basis of MLM is that products must be sold to the end-users. A ponzi scheme is a scheme where people earn commissions from recruiting others into the scheme, with totally no product being sold.
2) I understand that Sunshine is offering an investment plan, offering distributors the chance to invest in certain real estate projects in Malaysia. This is its product, MLM is merely the method of marketing the product.
3) Some of you have alleged that the construction and real estate project were deliberately conjured up by Phang as a means of duping investors into purchasing the plans. The allegation here is that Phang's projects are total fabrication and he did not have, nor will he ever have, the intention of actually completing the construction of the projects. This is a very serious allegation, and so far, there has been no evidence offered by any of the posters on this forum to support this allegation. All we are relying on so far is hearsay and rumours, based on individuals' perceptions of Phang's personality. Can we really rely on this to conclude that all of Phang's proposed property developments are utter fabrications? How then would one explain the detailed floor plans that Phang has provided? How are we to explain the photos of Phang and his colleagues at the construction sites, laying the foundations for the projects?
4) Some have mentioned that "ALL" of Phang's previous business ventures have been blacklisted by the CAD and/or shut down by the relevant authorities in various countries. Again, no sources were provided to support this. However, I only have one question to ask regarding this point. Why is Phang still a free man? Why has no dirt stuck to him, and why has he never been sent to prison? Surely, if he is a repeat offender, and one who has claimed thousands of victims across various jurisdictions, at least one criminal charge should have stuck to him by now?
5) Just because a company is under investigation does not mean they are guilty of any wrong doing. If they have indeed engaged in any wrong doing, then a prosecution must be brought, and a conviction must be secured. Or have we never heard of the maxim "innocent until proven guilty"?
I admit that I have little knowledge of Phang's personal history. However, I am basing my opinions on two things - One, the testimonies of two acquaintances whom I have personally met, and who have confirmed to me that they have made substantial profits as a result of their participation as distributors of Sunshine Empire. Two, the posts on this forum and the evidence cited to support the various arguments that have been offered.
I am merely offering the "other side of the coin", not supporting James Phang. I do not know the man, and cannot vouch for his character personally. However, I am very surprised that the mere mention of his name has managed to elicit such visceral and emotive reactions in people who similarly do not know him. Perhaps you have allowed yourselves to be worked up by sensational news reports and/or scandalous rumours spread by Phang's opponents. If they have failed in MLM, perhaps they themselves have to shoulder some responsibility, instead of simply blaming it all on the company. It is simply the easy way out to blame one's environment, just as a failed stock trader would blame the volatile market conditions, or a failed property investor would criticise the unpredictability of the real estate market. The fact remains that in any sort of business, there is an element of risk, and an element of reward.
''Some of you have alleged that Sunshine Empire is not even an MLM at all, but rather, a ponzi scheme. The basis of MLM is that products must be sold to the end-users. A ponzi scheme is a scheme where people earn commissions from recruiting others into the scheme, with totally no product being sold.
2) I understand that Sunshine is offering an investment plan, offering distributors the chance to invest in certain real estate projects in Malaysia. This is its product, MLM is merely the method of marketing the product.''
If you have no knowledge of Phang's past companies and his history and have done so little research of SE.. i would suggest that you dont bother to place so much opinions here...you are just making youself look dumb.
SE is NOT a MLM. MLM is strictly goods/services. You want sell investment plan, you need register yourself with MAS and put a lump sum deposit and at the same time submit your company credentials for approval. For goodness sake, you need a license! Stop voicing out nonsense here.
''The allegation here is that Phang's projects are total fabrication and he did not have, nor will he ever have, the intention of actually completing the construction of the projects. This is a very serious allegation, and so far, there has been no evidence offered by any of the posters on this forum to support this allegation''
For the above, please go read the straits times and newpaper archives. The only serious thing here is that you are not reading enough.
I have testimonies from Wilson and Ignitious. Ask your two friends who they are.
''If they have failed in MLM, perhaps they themselves have to shoulder some responsibility, instead of simply blaming it all on the company. It is simply the easy way out to blame one's environment, just as a failed stock trader would blame the volatile market conditions, or a failed property investor would criticise the unpredictability of the real estate market. The fact remains that in any sort of business, there is an element of risk, and an element of reward.''
For the above, yes the easy way out is what Phang would do when his companies fail. Dont believe? Ask anyone up here what he told the media when China Dream and Magic Kingdom failed. and this is again reported in Strait Times.
''Just because a company is under investigation does not mean they are guilty of any wrong doing. If they have indeed engaged in any wrong doing, then a prosecution must be brought, and a conviction must be secured. Or have we never heard of the maxim "innocent until proven guilty"?''
For the above, yupe we heard that before. But do you see an innocent company under investigation asking ALL its members to resign now and join an offshore registered company instead?
"Why is Phang still a free man?"
Cos his name wasnt registered at all in the last 3 companies that he set up including NTI and Sunshine Empire---after he was probed by CAD for his involvment in China Dream and Magic Kingdom early this decade.
"Providing the other side of the coin."
The only side of the coin that you are presenting is your ignorance.
For you information, Sunshine empire is already in the motion of getting ALL its members to resign and transfer all their accounts to Hong Kong registered, Emmax, a company that Phang has told the Straits Times that he has NEVER heard of. And you are still here trying to talk/defend about the SE projects/investigation results/Phang's integrity bla bla bla bla..... i know the timing difference from Europe and here is a couple of hours away but the timing of your brain and reality is like 12 months apart. We are already at Dual Core technology, please stop using your 486 Deluxe.
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Originally posted by christopher_rf:
Wah, it has been some time sinced I've logged on,
Nth can be said till results by CAD is out,
Anyway Emmax doing so well now.
cheers
Didnt Phang said hes not connected with Emmax?
Why is SE shutting down if its doing so well?
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Originally posted by Brains:
''Some of you have alleged that Sunshine Empire is not even an MLM at all, but rather, a ponzi scheme. The basis of MLM is that products must be sold to the end-users. A ponzi scheme is a scheme where people earn commissions from recruiting others into the scheme, with totally no product being sold.
2) I understand that Sunshine is offering an investment plan, offering distributors the chance to invest in certain real estate projects in Malaysia. This is its product, MLM is merely the method of marketing the product.''
If you have no knowledge of Phang's past companies and his history and have done so little research of SE.. i would suggest that you dont bother to place so much opinions here...you are just making youself look dumb.
SE is NOT a MLM. MLM is strictly goods/services. You want sell investment plan, you need register yourself with MAS and put a lump sum deposit and at the same time submit your company credentials for approval. For goodness sake, you need a license! Stop voicing out nonsense here.
''The allegation here is that Phang's projects are total fabrication and he did not have, nor will he ever have, the intention of actually completing the construction of the projects. This is a very serious allegation, and so far, there has been no evidence offered by any of the posters on this forum to support this allegation''
For the above, please go read the straits times and newpaper archives. The only serious thing here is that you are not reading enough.
I have testimonies from Wilson and Ignitious. Ask your two friends who they are.
''If they have failed in MLM, perhaps they themselves have to shoulder some responsibility, instead of simply blaming it all on the company. It is simply the easy way out to blame one's environment, just as a failed stock trader would blame the volatile market conditions, or a failed property investor would criticise the unpredictability of the real estate market. The fact remains that in any sort of business, there is an element of risk, and an element of reward.''
For the above, yes the easy way out is what Phang would do when his companies fail. Dont believe? Ask anyone up here what he told the media when China Dream and Magic Kingdom failed. and this is again reported in Strait Times.
''Just because a company is under investigation does not mean they are guilty of any wrong doing. If they have indeed engaged in any wrong doing, then a prosecution must be brought, and a conviction must be secured. Or have we never heard of the maxim "innocent until proven guilty"?''
For the above, yupe we heard that before. But do you see an innocent company under investigation asking ALL its members to resign now and join an offshore registered company instead?
"Why is Phang still a free man?"
Cos his name wasnt registered at all in the last 3 companies that he set up including NTI and Sunshine Empire---after he was probed by CAD for his involvment in China Dream and Magic Kingdom early this decade.
"Providing the other side of the coin."
The only side of the coin that you are presenting is your ignorance.
For you information, Sunshine empire is already in the motion of getting ALL its members to resign and transfer all their accounts to Hong Kong registered, Emmax, a company that Phang has told the Straits Times that he has NEVER heard of. And you are still here trying to talk/defend about the SE projects/investigation results/Phang's integrity bla bla bla bla..... i know the timing difference from Europe and here is a couple of hours away but the timing of your brain and reality is like 12 months apart. We are already at Dual Core technology, please stop using your 486 Deluxe.
please stop trying to defending james phang here... stock markets and such are now made to fail.. unlike jame's phangs dreams... which are made to fail.. designed to failwow u are still at dual core.. no wonder u are still defending james phang... we are now already at QX9775 core 2 quad extereme while you are still with your dual core...
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Originally posted by elementalangel:
please stop trying to defending james phang here... stock markets and such are now made to fail.. unlike jame's phangs dreams... which are made to fail.. designed to failwow u are still at dual core.. no wonder u are still defending james phang... we are now already at QX9775 core 2 quad extereme while you are still with your dual core...
who u trying to shoot?
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Here is my contribution.
The Project at Malacca.
Only the Empire Sunhsine Villa is real.
The rest, base on my analyisis, is an almost Impossibility.
EPV would have to buy over more than 8 land owners who own 'sea frontage' lands, in order to reclaim land to built their Theme Park, including a School, 2 Condos, a Mosque, 2 Seaside restaurants, and a Resort.
Do Malaysian Laws allows land reclaimation to 1 Party to extend land masses in the sea to adjoining land masses when the 'shore lands' do not belong to that Party?
I would sure welcome SE Merchants to bring this question (& my diagram) and ask EPV this question.
Coming up... The facts on KL Project....
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SE ppl are busy transfering funds to Emmax in HK
Something abt SE/Emmax:
http://www.thehyipforum.com/showthread.php?t=20849
This is posted:
http://www.thehyipforum.com/message25773-emmax.html
This guy is promoting Emmax
http://profiles.friendster.com/4465838 -
OK. You make a convincing case. Perhaps I should go and read more about Phang.
However, off hand, I have one very major doubt. I do not believe that it would be possible for Phang to escape the net of the Singapore Government if he is truly a serial fraudster. Surely the other scam businesses would have been busted, and people would be arrested - did they not implicate Phang? Who were the scape goats? Why did they volunteer to be scape goats for Phang?
It is odd that Phang remains free to this day with totally no mud sticking to him.
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Its odd that a lawyer find it odd, who supposed to know that the workings of the legal system is not perfect
I know lawyers to be sharp and to the point, but your general statements mirrors what a typical SE agent would say, except that command of English is better
I have no choice but to dismiss you as unbelievable
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Legally JP might not be part of them. Like how poor Jackie Hoo had been appointed CEO. Arrows will be flying his way, not Phang's.
Convincing? Its convincing enough. NOP, NTI, Magic Kingdom, China Dream, SE/EGA. Emcom. All failed. Emcom Taichung wireles project suddenly vanished.
All the property projects, they would cost hundreds of millions of dollars, and they're being carried out all at once. And they never advertise, or at least not mainstream, their property projects. For the KL and Malacca project, designs were changed many times, even after project had been sold. They claim internal selling only, u think they can sell every unit within such a small pool of customers?
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a103/abductboy/servicesuite.jpg
Before the so called projects were announced SE was already giving payouts. Where to these payouts come from?
Being "merchants" or people who had put our money in, don't you think we have every right to know what the company does?
Sorry bro.... you had blown your cover by saying
"James Phang is a modern-day Robin Hood, and he is plugging the huge gaps in society by helping the poor to catch up with the rich." "Mr James Phang is enriching thousands of lives in Singapore."
As a lawyer don't you know what he is doing is actually illegal? By taking money from the bottom to pay the top, and starting some projects to "dilute" the image as a pyramid scheme? As a laywer don't you know it's not easy to change a building's design after it's been approved? As a lawyer don't you know that SE had been investigated all over Asia? Sg, malaysia, Indon, etc?
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Exactly!
Accurate Fraud, just as you urge us not to assume that JP is a fraudster, how can you then conclude that he is a modern day Robin Hood, after you've admittedly confess that you have little or no knowledge of JP's prior dealings and businesses?
This is certainly inconsistent with someone who has been practicing law, isn't it?
Or are you a law school dropout who is now a merchant of SE? I know, this is just a wild guess on my part. :)Hey, I never say that I was a lawyer hor!
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Jacky will take all rap for JP.. he's already paid and would be happy enough to do that. .. found out from my usual sources that there's a syndicate behind all these and JP is only just one major chess piece of everything. And its true that Swiss cash is from the same syndicate as well (think someone up here did mention this before)...
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Originally posted by Brains:
Jacky will take all rap for JP.. he's already paid and would be happy enough to do that. .. found out from my usual sources that there's a syndicate behind all these and JP is only just one major chess piece of everything. And its true that Swiss cash is from the same syndicate as well (think someone up here did mention this before)...
what syndicate and how does it work for the ppl who gains the most? -
I would love to know what happened to Emcom wireless project in Taichung they were so enthusiastically promoting few months ago.
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Accurate fraud :I am a Millioniare
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You very naive and simple minded. The rich here pay the most tax. Road tax, GST, property / commercial property tax, stamp duty .... approx $50,000 per year. I started from zero without any help To be poor does not give you the right to con. The SE was set with the ulterior motive to cheat right from the begining. This is not business or MlM. It was register in " Tua Peh Kong " name , to take the rap ( It was design to perform this task.
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Green horn let me give you some tips ,Looks around you, there many businesesare some sort cheating , All parrallel importer of cars, all of them got their car through a bogus company register under a " Tua Peh Kong " name. This company will undervlaue the invoice to delcalre the tax to Sgv. Our customs also are well aware they are not stupid. Now and then they will move in and close them .. But the smarter one's will not undervalue to the extreme. The dare devil will do ...extreme attract the attention and The custom will do them ..... They whom thread the tolerable line ( Thin red line, grey area )dance on the thin red line will survive and be flexiable..... By the way , I did not consider migrating because the taxes are cheaper here... compare to other countries. Yes we are not a welfare state, But I need no welfare . I am bless good hand and legs I work hard for my dues ... It is the lazy and dreamer that the day the sky will rain rain gold. Dream are good but you be able to execute it into action. Knowlege is power but must know how to applied. I did not go to U, sori for the english. But I can assure you that you not what you claim.I am already in mid age, meet alot of pleople in life and done alot thing. It not my usual self to post but could not resist anymore. For the sake many whom are not street smart,
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This time round, JP has challenge the thin red thin to new level and done it too big he finished.CAD will close this book. Unfortunately, the rich are not caught in this SE. ( The rich did not aquaire the riches by stupid and greedy.) Very sadly, it the poor and the wages earner that believe his story. AS in my earlier post ( which I do not wish to elaborate again) the postwomen , painter, the poor aunty, uncle, student , wage eaner ... has you seen any sucessful businessman there , NO. My friend , business associcate .... in the millionire league are not there or approached .... My heart is with the poor cause I was very poor before.... The poor got poorer. Your excuse claiming that our mind set can accept your ideal.. We help ourselve nobody own us a living. Very stocking your metality is coffee talk with the iliterate.. we work with the enviroment not against it, we adapte and change to suit... the situation to our favour. Not long ago, was talking to a young graduate , sound very like your thinking... Had to tell him off, that all his ideal is not new ... Its long ago already thought .. but not pratical and did not execute it... Whatever ideal of his has already been thought by us ... Sometime later when techno advancement the combination then only we could implement it.My advise to him is to advance the new frontier in computer .... where everybody is new...learning.... no model to copy. Go and watch the Young and dangerous.... you will understand. I have posted too many . Time to shut up and move on....... Rome is not build in one day, It take a theif to caught a theif, you reap what you sow. Honesty is the Best policy.
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no idea which syndicate. Information not make available/open to me.
wireless project? its true but didnt anyone tell you that there's also another one thousands companies in Taiwan trying to create/research some form wireless technology also? haa.. and yes Emcom is just one of these one thousands companies...