New Creation Church - Church of Cheap Grace?
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don't flame me..just for your inform..
Cheap grace is to God's grace what cubic zirconia is to diamonds and plastic is to fine crystal. The thirsty soul drinking in cheap grace is like being in a desert, dying of thirst, and only having salt water to drink!
This is what Bonhoeffer says of "cheap grace": "It is the preaching of forgiveness without requiring repentance, baptism without church discipline, Communion without confession, absolution without personal confession. Cheap grace is ...
• grace without discipleship
• grace without the cross
• grace without Jesus Christ, living and incarnate."
Cheap grace arises when a sinner desires to be saved, but doesn't want to become a disciple. A true believer must resist cheap grace and enter the life of active discipleship. Faith can no longer mean passively sitting still and waiting. Christians must arise and follow Christ.
Bonhoeffer taught that cheap grace makes man soft and complacent, fearful of self-sacrifice and personal debasement. He believed that the teaching of cheap grace was the ruin of more Christians than any commandment of works. For Bonhoeffer, discipleship means strict adherence to Christ and God's moral commandments. -
lets twisted this a little bit, lets say I am guilty, and lets say I don't have the money to hire a lawyer.Originally posted by prataboy:did read that christ is our consellor and adovacte....WHO sit at the right hand side of GOD.So when you reach heaven so are you going to juifity...or keep on saying i am under grace...do you think you enter the heaven door.
imagine ,if one day or fine by a mata for jaywalking which you didn't do it...and u engage a lawyer to defence you..do u tell the lawyer that or i am under grace,i have faith ,i call your name and i engage you know...
Think wat the lawyer will do..
Justice : Vince69 is guilty and the pubishment is $10,000 fine.
*Note: I don't have the money to pay.
Grace : The Judge have pity and paid the fine for me.
the same is this,
We all had sinned, and we have absolutely no means to pay the penalty.
God Sent us His son, who is of no sin, to pay the penalty on our behalf, that we may by Grace through Christ received reconcilation with God.
Now, back to the story, if I were to reject his payment, I had to pay the penalty myself as insisted by myself.
If I were to accept his offer but want to add things over his payment, I am doubting his mercy and grace.
The same with us, some chose to pay the penalty of sin themselves without God and Christ, some want to add work over and on top of what Christ did on the cross, thus showing doubt that Christ's dealth on the cross is not complete and finished.
God Bless. -
yes god have pay a heavy price for you and redemmer yopu by dieding on the cross thru grace,compassion and mercy..but as a christian can u jusfity it......when you enter heaven when christ is there saying hi ,i have a price for can you jusifty your faith.....yest it free law suit for for you..but can tell me and jusifty it..Originally posted by vince69:lets twisted this a little bit, lets say I am guilty, and lets say I don't have the money to hire a lawyer.
Justice : Vince69 is guilty and the pubishment is $10,000 fine.
*Note: I don't have the money to pay.
Grace : The Judge have pity and paid the fine for me.
the same is this,
We all had sinned, and we have absolutely no means to pay the penalty.
God Sent us His son, who is of no sin, to pay the penalty on our behalf, that we may by Grace through Christ received reconcilation with God.
Now, back to the story, if I were to reject his payment, I had to pay the penalty myself as insisted by myself.
If I were to accept his offer but want to add things over his payment, I am doubting his mercy and grace.
The same with us, some chose to pay the penalty of sin themselves without God and Christ, some want to add work over and on top of what Christ did on the cross, thus showing doubt that Christ's dealth on the cross is not complete and finished.
God Bless. -
by doing that you are untrusting him.......and putting HIM on the cross again..which HE died for you...wihtout saying the cos ...Originally posted by vince69:lets twisted this a little bit, lets say I am guilty, and lets say I don't have the money to hire a lawyer.
Justice : Vince69 is guilty and the pubishment is $10,000 fine.
*Note: I don't have the money to pay.
Grace : The Judge have pity and paid the fine for me.
the same is this,
We all had sinned, and we have absolutely no means to pay the penalty.
God Sent us His son, who is of no sin, to pay the penalty on our behalf, that we may by Grace through Christ received reconcilation with God.
Now, back to the story, if I were to reject his payment, I had to pay the penalty myself as insisted by myself.
If I were to accept his offer but want to add things over his payment, I am doubting his mercy and grace.
The same with us, some chose to pay the penalty of sin themselves without God and Christ, some want to add work over and on top of what Christ did on the cross, thus showing doubt that Christ's dealth on the cross is not complete and finished.
God Bless. -
CCC - Christian City Church AustraliaOriginally posted by babyys:r u deranged or have you forgotten to take your medicine???
so r saying that churches who have bands (musical instruments), worship team, lightings r CCC Style???
Musical instruments, Worship team and lightings are not styles....
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Christian City Church....Originally posted by breytonhartge:more likely Calvary Charismatic Church... -
oopsss....sorrie!Originally posted by M©+square:CCC - Christian City Church Australia
Musical instruments, Worship team and lightings are not styles....
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Yup....i know why you seemed irked by my former post. My apologies for not typing in full.Originally posted by babyys:oopsss....sorrie!
You know CCC and CHC have extremely close ties with one another right?
So i thought it's understood that CCC is naturally referring to Christian City.
*Looking for one of the old worship song by them...hai....* -
the teaching of Scripture alone is not contained in this one verse only. It is a systematic study of all pertinent verses spread in the Bible. If i would have to write all the verses and expound them exegetically one by one.....i would be writing a book.Originally posted by SingaporeMacross:it's odd that you have used this argument when your protestant forefathers chose not to.
If Paul is using this verse to advocate scripture alone, he would have been advocating one of four principles, which are inconsistent with the rest of his theology:
(1) Accept as authoritative only the Old Testament writings;
(2) accept as authoritative only the Old Testament writings and the New Testament writings penned as of the date Paul wrote 1 Corinthians (circa A.D. 56);
(3) accept as authoritative orally transmitted doctrine only until it has been reduced to writing (scripture) and only while the apostles are alive, then disregard all oral tradition and adhere only to what is written; or
(4) accept as authoritative only doctrine that has been reduced to writing.
Needless to say nobody will say that option 1 is acceptable. We cannot accept option two either, for this would mean all New Testament books written after the year 56 would not qualify under the 1 Corinthians 4:6 guideline. Hence, John's Gospel, Acts, Romans, 2 Corinthians, Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, Philemon, Titus, 1 & 2 Timothy, Hebrews, James, 1 & 2 Peter, 1, 2, & 3 John, Jude, and Revelation would all have to be jettisoned as non-authoritative.
Option three fails because in order for sola scriptura to be a "biblical" doctrine there must be, by definition, at least one Bible verse which says Scripture is sufficient, or that oral Tradition is to be ignored once Scripture has supplanted it, or that Scripture is superior to oral Tradition. But there are no such verses; and as we'll see, 1 Corinthians 4:6 is no exception.
Option four is likewise untenable because it contradicts Paul's express command in to "Stand fast and hold firm to the traditions that you were taught, either by an oral statement or by a letter of ours" (2 Thess. 2:15). Thus, for 1 Corinthians 4:6 to support the theory of sola scriptura, Paul would be contradicting what he wrote in 2 Thess 2:15.
Furthermore, If Paul had been promulgating sola scriptura in 1 Corinthians 4 he would have been in conflict with the practice of the rest of the apostles. Most of the apostles never wrote a single line of Scripture; instead they transmitted the deposit of faith orally. Did their oral teachings carry any less weight of authority than the written teachings of Paul or Peter or John?
So the thing for you to consider is that if most of the apostles did not write any scriptures, how did they teach? Obviously by Oral Tradition!
[at this time i do not wish to engage myself in writing a theological dissertation about the doctrine of Scripture alone so clearly taught in the Bible just as the doctrine of the Trinity {of course you agree with the doctrine of the Trinity right?....... eventhough the word does not appear in the Bible right?}......my mind is weary and my body is convalescing]
"Do not go beyond what is written" is a principle that Paul wanted his readers to learn. -
ok nvm, u better rest first...
no!!!! tomorrow got school!!!! ahh!! -
Its a humanly prob dat we tend to jump to conclusion so easily. I can be pretty hot-headed at times. Forgive me?Originally posted by M©+square:Yup....i know why you seemed irked by my former post. My apologies for not typing in full.
You know CCC and CHC have extremely close ties with one another right?
So i thought it's understood that CCC is naturally referring to Christian City.
*Looking for one of the old worship song by them...hai....*
Wats the title??? Let me c if i have it.
Anyway wz regards to the Sacraments, from my understanding the wine & bread are just representation of Christ's Body & Blood as per the bible.
Receiving of Divine healing is through your faith and not by partaking of any sacraments. -
Title is Holy One Of God. I think it's from there 2nd CD which was 1997/8???Originally posted by babyys:Its a humanly prob dat we tend to jump to conclusion so easily. I can be pretty hot-headed at times. Forgive me?
Wats the title??? Let me c if i have it.
Anyway wz regards to the Sacraments, from my understanding the wine & bread are just representation of Christ's Body & Blood as per the bible.
Receiving of Divine healing is through your faith and not by partaking of any sacraments.
Very very good song.
I don't know if CHC still sing that song.
Yes to your last statement. -
Ok let me go dig it into my collection & update u. if have how do i upload it for u?Originally posted by M©+square:Title is Holy One Of God. I think it's from there 2nd CD which was 1997/8???
Very very good song.
I don't know if CHC still sing that song.
Yes to your last statement. -
I would so much rather we look into ourselves first before we move about onto others.
I was a person who had a lot to say about other churches and christians, but it was one day where I looked into myself and wondered why I ever had these things to say... Disagree we might, but I'm not too sure we are that different in falleness. -
Gosh! u sound so much like GANDALFF of LOTR!!!Originally posted by SingaporeTyrannosaur:I would so much rather we look into ourselves first before we move about onto others.
I was a person who had a lot to say about other churches and christians, but it was one day where I looked into myself and wondered why I ever had these things to say... Disagree we might, but I'm not too sure we are that different in falleness.