Lay Up And Redeployment of SMRT's Scania L113CRL (ELBO CAC)
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For me:
TIB8xxx on 187 [full route bnL int old to WDL Int]
TIB8xxx on 187 [teck whye lrt bus-stop to wdl int]
both were taken in summer 2006 :(
so sad sia -
Originally posted by AntiDennisLance:
I think the Elbo bodyworks and internal furnishings are not suitable for the Scania suspensions. To make the buses more lasting probably require a rebodying. Otherwise you can see the aircon, wall and ceiling panels coming loose all the time even after any refurbishment. The aircon cant really be helped - unlike the Merc CAC's, the Elbo's overhead ductings, panels and vents were never meant to conduct processed air anyway. They were originally meant to be NAC's all the way. If you increase the Aircon power/output, all it does is to leak the cool air out at the first non-airtight spot along the conduit.
SBS Transit's NAC buses (i.e. the Volvo B10M MKII, Mercedes MB O405, and Scania N113CRB) were also never meant to be air-conditioned buses.
We all know what SBS Transit did to them to make sure they can be air-conditioned buses.
Also, going back further in time, there's the rebodied Soon Chow 'Baco' Leyland/Guy Victories...
It's whether SMRT wants to do it, or not. These buses should have about a decade until the end of their lifespan if left on the roads.
And it's probably better than spending more money on new buses. Didn't they give this as an excuse to resist purchasing new MRT trains for their old lines initially, refurbishing the old ones instead? Why adopt a totally opposite direction for buses?
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Originally posted by eX.A.K.R.:
SBS Transit's NAC buses (i.e. the Volvo B10M MKII, Mercedes MB O405, and Scania N113CRB) were also never meant to be air-conditioned buses.
We all know what SBS Transit did to them to make sure they can be air-conditioned buses.
Also, going back further in time, there's the rebodied Soon Chow 'Baco' Leyland/Guy Victories...
It's whether SMRT wants to do it, or not. These buses should have about a decade until the end of their lifespan if left on the roads.
And it's probably better than spending more money on new buses. Didn't they give this as an excuse to resist purchasing new MRT trains for their old lines initially, refurbishing the old ones instead? Why adopt a totally opposite direction for buses?
You forget about economies of scale. The SBS Mercs and Scania NAC's as well as the B10M's number in the sheer hundreds and nearing a thousand. In whatever case the contractor would be able to give quotations that justify mass productions of the refurbishments. Now we are talking about only 15 units. Elbo bodyworks are not very common; the interior fittings as well as the wheel well skirtings were showing to be of inferior quality so I dont think SMRT would want to go back to them for refurbishments. The only other option would be getting third party contractors to do it but to custom design a refurbishment kit just for 15 units may not be worth the effort and money. -
Originally posted by AntiDennisLance:
You forget about economies of scale. The SBS Mercs and Scania NAC's as well as the B10M's number in the sheer hundreds and nearing a thousand. In whatever case the contractor would be able to give quotations that justify mass productions of the refurbishments. Now we are talking about only 15 units. Elbo bodyworks are not very common; the interior fittings as well as the wheel well skirtings were showing to be of inferior quality so I dont think SMRT would want to go back to them for refurbishments. The only other option would be getting third party contractors to do it but to custom design a refurbishment kit just for 15 units may not be worth the effort and money.Then may I know how many Leyland/Guy Victories were rebodied? While you are right in saying that economies of scale is a problem, if SBS Transit (then SBS) was able to do it with a small number of Leyland/Guy Victories, surely something could be done with the ELBO Scanias.
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As a company, such an early retirement would be of quite some loss... It is true that these buses are non-standard in the fleet, but they could be relegated to services that require lesser buses and have lesser passenger flow, then the buses and fleet could be adjusted...
An early retirement would be feasible if there is going to be large scale fleet adjustments or that these buses have found a foreign buyer. A vehicle more is perhaps, a few seconds lesser of wait...
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Originally posted by TIB744U:
Sorry, just to clarify something here. TIB839E is spotted as usual on 970 today. If you think is rego alphabet or number mistake, TIB840A is spotted on 852 today. As of today, ONLY TIB833X & TIB835R are listed as lay-up on the LTA website.
I saw TIB839E just now also... Scared me I thought that one also laid up liao...
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Originally posted by SBS9816E:
Are you feel very sad and depressed that this particular ELBO has laid up?
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Originally posted by eX.A.K.R.:
Then may I know how many Leyland/Guy Victories were rebodied? While you are right in saying that economies of scale is a problem, if SBS Transit (then SBS) was able to do it with a small number of Leyland/Guy Victories, surely something could be done with the ELBO Scanias.
I dont know... but I guess things back then are not the same as things now. For a start I am not even sure if the 15 year limit for public buses applied back then. Yes, the Elbo 113's going would be some sort of a waste. But I guess it had been a weighted decision. I sure do not like Dennis Lances and in fact I would prefer a ride in an Elbo Scania over a Lance any day. But I think using similar reasonings the Lances will get to see their full 15/17 year cycle with a round of refurb perhaps if necessary.
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Originally posted by eX.A.K.R.:
Then may I know how many Leyland/Guy Victories were rebodied? While you are right in saying that economies of scale is a problem, if SBS Transit (then SBS) was able to do it with a small number of Leyland/Guy Victories, surely something could be done with the ELBO Scanias.
Rebodying the buses may be an option. But with the OCs coming in, it'll be easier to just replace then to actually rebody the Scanias. Don't think SMRT will rebody them (scrapping them for a flat fee can balance out with the OCs).As for your theory with refurbishing the trains by SMRT
- the trainsets can techincally last quite long even with daily usuage.
- They didn't have rebodying. The original body is just painted/stickered over with a new livery, and refurbished with a new interior.
- They don't have engine components and vibrations found in the Scanias Elbos, they run on motors.
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Originally posted by lemon1974:
put these buses as training buses loh..i dun think SMRT will lay up these buses cos of passengers complains. Most likely they are facing difficulties/high cost in maintaining these buses?
My sentiments....There must be pressing problems mantaining the body rather than the chassis....
Evidence can already be seen from the parts replaced on the body. They aren't ELBO stuff.
It might even be true to say that the 132 OCs were purchased to replace the L113s as well. All in all, it does not look like the decision was made overnight. Waste or not, that's a matter of perspective and SMRT would probably have done their maths to come to that.
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Originally posted by 16/f/lonely:
My sentiments....There must be pressing problems mantaining the body rather than the chassis....
Evidence can already be seen from the parts replaced on the body. They aren't ELBO stuff.
It might even be true to say that the 132 OCs were purchased to replace the L113s as well. All in all, it does not look like the decision was made overnight. Waste or not, that's a matter of perspective and SMRT would probably have done their maths to come to that.
My christmas wish was actually keeping the ELBOs and the U31RCNs.
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Originally posted by SBS8033D:
My christmas wish was actually keeping the ELBOs and the U31RCNs.
SMRT's christmas wish isnt, period. -
Originally posted by jayh272416:
SMRT's christmas wish isnt, period.lol, so sad.
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Originally posted by SBS8033D:
lol, so sad.
haha yeah. i like ELBO leh =( -
Originally posted by AntiDennisLance:
I dont know... but I guess things back then are not the same as things now. For a start I am not even sure if the 15 year limit for public buses applied back then. Yes, the Elbo 113's going would be some sort of a waste. But I guess it had been a weighted decision. I sure do not like Dennis Lances and in fact I would prefer a ride in an Elbo Scania over a Lance any day. But I think using similar reasonings the Lances will get to see their full 15/17 year cycle with a round of refurb perhaps if necessary.
I think SMRT is speeding up the non-Mercedes buses like UD and ELBO is due to their bad conditions and the ability to meet the WAB requirement from LTA, which is 40% of the total fleet by 2010. If they have no intentions to expand the fleet for now, the only way to meet the quota is only by getting rid of the older buses.
But I think the UMW Dennis Lances needs refurbishment more than any other buses, thanks to the all fabric interior.
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Originally posted by off_service:
I think SMRT is speeding up the non-Mercedes buses like UD and ELBO is due to their bad conditions and the ability to meet the WAB requirement from LTA, which is 40% of the total fleet by 2010. If they have no intentions to expand the fleet for now, the only way to meet the quota is only by getting rid of the older buses.
But I think the UMW Dennis Lances needs refurbishment more than any other buses, thanks to the all fabric interior.
Speaking from what you said, i think the next victim would be our dear DAF SB220LT. This was rumoured by a PRC BC from Sv 975. -
Originally posted by eX.A.K.R.:
They are withdrawing buses that are just over a decade old over commuter complains? Can't those problems be fixed rather than wastefully scrapping otherwise-perfectly good buses?
No wonder SMRT's bus division is bleeding oceans of money, and no wonder fares keep going up.
Actually e aircon system isn't tat goodas for losses. very simple, you go see Sv 61. peak hrs need to wait 15 mins for 1 packed bus, off peak in 20 mins time belt lucky can see 4 empty ones arriving... wun lose $$ then is big news
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SMRT gotta bring in another 220+ more buses to meet e 40% WAB fleet
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Got my first ELBO ride today.
Only thing I don't like about the bus is the aircon system. Cant adjust one... Love the windows.. 
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Originally posted by off_service:
But I think the UMW Dennis Lances needs refurbishment more than any other buses, thanks to the all fabric interior.
agreed. otherwise kenna early lay-up also. particuarly e m'sian 1s.
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Originally posted by Stage:
Got my first ELBO ride today.
Only thing I don't like about the bus is the aircon system. Cant adjust one... Love the windows..
This yr was olso my first ELBO ride on svc 187. I olso love the windows but the air con duct.. just 2 simple holes lol. when its in idle mode, itll go 'rattle rattle rattle' Transmission sound is similar to the UDs. -
Originally posted by SMRT BUSES LuvER:
This yr was olso my first ELBO ride on svc 187. I olso love the windows but the air con duct.. just 2 simple holes lol. when its in idle mode, itll go 'rattle rattle rattle' Transmission sound is similar to the UDs.I took mine on 966.
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Originally posted by SMRT BUSES LuvER:
This yr was olso my first ELBO ride on svc 187. I olso love the windows but the air con duct.. just 2 simple holes lol. when its in idle mode, itll go 'rattle rattle rattle' Transmission sound is similar to the UDs.
TIB842U is gonecase. -
so UD + ELBO + DAF = 132 OC??
if so, then SMRT must have planned this out way back already.
then this means bus frequencies remain the same and no new trunk services. tsk tsk -
If SMRT is trying to achieve a 40% WAB fleet while trying to avoid a fleet expansion at all costs, then I can forsee a real disaster for everyone later on. And when I said everyone, I really mean everyone: SMRT's management will have to explain why they squandered away so much money on buying new buses to replace old buses that still have a considerable number of years within their statuory lifespan and could probably be fixed more cheaply, and why - if they were running out of depot space, were they not planning to get a new bus depot; commuters will continue having to put up with unaceptably- and unbearably-long waiting times for SMRT buses, and bus fans will grieve over the loss of several bus models and the further "Stalinisation" of the local bus fleet.
Trust me, while I'm not sure where Saw Phaik Hwa is taking SMRT buses to, I'm pretty sure she only thought about herself and her bank account when she made the decisions, and no-one and nothing else.
When this disaster happens, I bet she will have a lot of explaining to do, if she hasn't ran off with the money and left the carnage for someone else to take over, that is.